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If it wasn't for the web, I wouldn't even be aware that Zunes exist. I've never seen a Zune at the Best Buys or Future Shops here in Alberta, Canada. Their flyers never advertise them, and even their web sites return nothing when you do a search for them.

Paul - you do fail to point out that the 30gig Zune that was number one on Amazon is being sold for 90 bucks! So instead of them being sold at their original price - a 249 value - they are being sold off at a major loss to Microsoft.

Amazon doesn't order each individual Zune30 for each buyer.......direct from MS to dropship to the buyer!  Come on now, that's not how stocked items are paid for and resold.  Amazon buys an ass-ton of these things at whatever price and then resells them for whatever they want.  If they can work a "credit" with MS then fantastic, otherwise they're takin' the hit on the price.  Having said, whadaya wanna bet Amazon didn't pay anywhere near 249 per unit??

.......just like how places like Walmart and Kmart work.

Paul, I'd take offense, too. How DARE MacWorld fail to mention that the sole reason for the Zune's appearance in the number one spot was due to a dramatic price cut? Come on...if you're going to "take exception", then insist that they tell the whole story. The Zune is popular on Amazon because of yard-sale pricing.

I mean, really! How could they have left that out? They must HATE low prices! They must HATE Microsoft. Those zealots!

You should set them straight immediately. After all, you're the sole voice of reason in tech media, right?

I own MS stock and really want it to do well, but alas, John is correct, the best seller was sold at $90 and the preorders were discounted for another player I think. However, anyone without bias should not 'take exception' to any comment dude, especially with the above knowledge.

Sir Timbit, there was a nice Zune section at the local Target in NJ which was as big as the iPod section, and had several empty spaces suggesting sold products. I just saw a beautiful full page Zune ad in one of my PC Mags. It's about time MS! Fire your old marketing team cause they suck! This is from one of your stock holders. The one or two Zune TV commercials were just terrible. And yes, the Mac/PC commercials are no longer funny to me, as cross platform user, so Apple, give Justin a new line, like how well Windows/Microsoft and Mac work together. Today only is a $100 rebate on MS Office 2004 for Mac with a free upgrade to 2008, for $125 at Amazon]. My friends and I quickly bought it.

Peace.

I take this as a compliment... I mean, they bash Windows so hard because they know they are inferior. Now they are bashing the Zune which would indicate they feel threatened... It's simple iPsychology 101.

Briefly can also imply 'recent', although this is a poor choice of words for sure. So lets not over react, but both Apple and Microsoft fans should all applaud successful competition, which means that the companies will need to give more, improve or reduce prices, a win for we consumers [I buy this stuff for the wife and kids]. Oh, and go Sansa! The player that needs no software to add tunes! Drag and drop on a PC or Mac for a fraction of the cost of the competition. Buy 'em for the kids and don't be afraid to let them destroy it, cause it's cheap, real cheap!

I would like to add that, despite your crowing, this "success" is NOT at the expense of Apple. It is at the expense of all Microsoft's "partners" in the plays for sure alliance. So you partner with the big company and they shaft you... Good one - how to win friends and influence people.

<i>What they've said is that they're seeking to make this is a two-company race across the board, just as they did with hard drive-based MP3 players last year. That appears to be happening.</i>

So, you mean they're seriously claiming they do not need to compete against the likes of Sony Ericsson, Nokia, etc. in the future, but only Apple?

But hey, the guys at MS are so used to losing in all the new markets that who knows, they might actually be ignoring the biggest makers of portable music players when mapping their competition. Or maybe their future strategy is to only sell music and media players in the USA...

Paul - "What they've said is that they're seeking to make this is a two-company race across the board, just as they did with hard drive-based MP3 players last year. That appears to be happening."

Really?  When the vast majority of players sold are flash players and MS's new flash player, by your own admission, is #69?

What's happening, so far at least, is a blood bath, in the flash segment.  MS better fire up the astroturf campaign and ship some flash zunes to sit on the store shelves, before somebody writes a story that sales of flash zunes are dead in the water.

My error. The Zune  full page ad was not in MaximumPC. It was in US magazine, which obviously has a larger subscription base. There was nothing to read at the in-laws yesterday, so I picked up US, a girly gossip mag. But a smart place to advertise.

The Target section of Zunes were mostly the flash based players. There was a Zune accessory section as well. The Zune section pretty much matched the iPod section, although there were more iPod accessories,in the section. More iPod gear were scattered in other areas. Yes, I was there with the wife and kids.

Target and Best Buy are pretty crap at displaying both iPods and Zunes in my opinion. For example BB have an iPod touch on demo in my local store BUT have screwed it down to the "protective display thing" so hard that it actually damages the display. That and the fact that it has NO content loaded so it looks like a useless thing - good for MS but useless for Apple TBH.

Sir_Timbit, there is a good reason why you don't see any Zunes, and I'll point it out before Waethorn does, and that is that they are not sold in Canada.  <flame suit ON>So when you come down south for some quality health care, you can pick up a Zune while you're here.</flame suit OFF>

Nevertheless, I don't know why Paul is making such a big deal about this.  I don't know how well Zunes are selling, but it is best to wait for at least a whole month of availability before any kind of a analysis is made.  Shame on MacWorld too, but I don't expect them to get this right.  Apple people only know how to bash MS.

All the macboi'st that troll here are really something....don't you understand that incessantly queefing on Microsoft related blogs doesn't help your beloved iCompany in any way shape or form?

I understand your lives revolve around justifying why you pay so much to maintain a iLifestyle with shiny products with clever iNames but why whore yourselves out like you're getting paid. Atleast Apple PR get paid to for their BS.

Maybe y'all need to step back, wipe the iJizz of your iMac and take an iWalk down the iRoad realize there a big world out there and that Apple is an insignificant part of it.

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And if you find yourself in an Apple store paying for your 12th Ipod, the exercise has failed. :D

Wow, you're a clever guy weedmonk. You come up with all that witticism on your own?

Dipsh, we doctors love you! Yep, even us iDocs. God bless you man! Thanks.

About cfisher83 and weedmonk - again, why are these zero substance, 100 percent namecalling posts always from the windows guys here?  Funny, huh?

granted not all the windows enthusiasts are like this, but still.  none of the apple enthusiasts posting here do this.

"All the macboi'st that troll here are really something....don't you understand that incessantly queefing on Microsoft related blogs doesn't help your beloved iCompany in any way shape or form?"

FIrst: Paul has made it clear that this blog is not completely "Microsoft-related". Take a look at the top topics discussed--"Apple, iPod, iTunes, Mac"...they're all high on the list.

Second: This post is a Zune/iPod post. The iPod is a cross-platform music player. Most people that use it are, in fact, PC users, not "macbois".

Third: "queefing"? "whore"? "iJizz"? That's the best you can do? Your post exemplifies the kind of childish name-calling that you so crudely attribute to others. Way to prove a point.

Pingback from  re: Macworld tries to throw cold water on Zune success

Ya know, some of you complain that the Mac fanboys protest when Paul or some one does not write a rave review or post about an Apple product, but shoe is on the other foot here with 'this is a cute one' isn't it.

I am just trying to achieve balance gentlemen and Weedmonk. My custom built NINJA PC is about as beautiful as they come, and no one will convince me otherwise, especially since I am larger than all of you girly men.

- About cfisher83 and weedmonk - again, why are these zero substance, 100 percent namecalling posts always from the windows guys here?  Funny, huh?

What in my post had name calling? Now you're reading stuff that isn't there. Also, it's only zero substance if you don't take anything from it.

"What in my post had name calling? Now you're reading stuff that isn't there. Also, it's only zero substance if you don't take anything from it."

"hey bash Windows so hard because they know they are inferior. Now they are bashing the Zune which would indicate they feel threatened... It's simple iPsychology 101"

You said mac users are suffering from an inferiority complex.  that's namecalling in my book (and zero substance because it has nothing to do with the issues being discussed here - i.e., whether the new zunes are a success.)

Buy.com has the old Brown 30 GB Zune for $120, and the same one refurbished is $95. These are less than half the original price. That's amazing, but I guess they want to clear out old inventory for new. Next, they will be at the dollar store. Sansa clip 2GB that competes with the iPod shuffle, can be bought for $35, and it's crossplatform. Bring them prices down baby!

To the Softie zealots out here: (weedmonk and al.)

- This blog is not yours only

- Now I'll explain to you why some people who also like the Mac come here to read news and post comments, because apparently you seem to have trouble understanding first why some people buy Macs, and second why they come on this Blog:

They are some people out there who are interested by technology and computers in general. Some of them tried the Mac and loved it.

Some of them only read Mac oriented blog (the zealots) and some others are interested to read different take on computers including the Mac platform (and even if you don't like it it's not an insignificant platform).

Paul is one of the few Windows guy openly interested in the Mac platform, so it's interesting  to compare his point of view  vs. more mainstream publication (like slashdot or the register). Some windows zealots out here might not understand what's the point in reading websites that talks about something else than windows, and dare to criticize its weaknesses.

But still some dual Mac and Windows users like me like to read different point of view, and sometimes it's normal to bring back the Win enthusiasts here to reality when Paul tend to skew things a little bit towards MS and Windows... hey you can't blame him it's the guys that make him live !

So I guess that you'll have to accept the fact that all computer enthusiasts out here are not only windows users, that they are allowed to read whatever publication they want and to voice they opinion, even if you don't like it.

Now if you can't stand competition or other point of view, refrain from leaving comments here.

Spot on, Dave! I am at my XP Workstation now, but will be home at the Mac [and 4 other pc's/laptops] around 10 PM. It's a regular life, not a bipolar world, so I agree with all that you posted 100% [so not to get confused:)]

"You said mac users are suffering from an inferiority complex.  that's namecalling in my book (and zero substance because it has nothing to do with the issues being discussed here - i.e., whether the new zunes are a success.)"

Actually, name calling would be like saying all mac users are idiots, for example (which I'm NOT doing, just making an example :P...) but all I did was diagnose the Apple passive aggressive behaviour they've been exhibiting for years. I used past behaviour to show they are falling into the same pattern as before, proving the Zune's success, which has EVERYTHING to do with the point of this topic.

Cfisher83 - "all I did was diagnose the Apple passive aggressive behaviour they've been exhibiting for years."

Right, all you do is say mac users are suffering from some kind of mental defect ("inferiority complex," "passive aggressive behavior," {insert other random neurosis with a popular-sounding ring to it").  Hey guess what, to accuse a whole class of users of having some mental defect or problem is not only namecallling, its (1) insulting, (2) overly broad, and (3) necessarily based on ignorance, since you don't even know any significant (if any) of the people you are insulting.

"... mac users are suffering from some kind of mental defect "

Sorry to hear that.

cesjr, you are just proving my point even more. Although I never used the term you keep quoting "inferiority complex", I simply stated that the mac owners know their computers are inferior, which is why they defend their computers with so much passion.

and believe it or not I do know quite a few mac owners, and I have used a number of macs (I used one with Leopard today, and not my first Leopard experience either), and although not all of them are so-called 'macbois' the ones that bash windows constantly seem to come up with Straw Man arguments and over compensate in their support for Apple, that it is only common sense that Zune has become a threat because they are doing the same thing.

You may call it insulting, but that's because it's true. If you can't handle it, don't read a Windows blog.