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too me it seems apple is the one planing to spoil the MS launch event for the mice and WLVM.  MS made the official announcement first.  

Grow up, Paul.

Apparently it is totally okay for Apple to "spoil" CES year after year. Last year: MacWorld + iPhone. This year: Mac Pro announced a week before. Next year: Another MacWorld at the same time.

Seriously, I outlined all of this on my blog.

Yert...stop it with your blog.

Paul, you're obsessed. This can't be healthy.

Pulitzer prize winning journalism.

Pingback from  getfreeinsurance  » Blog Archive   » re: Microsoft continues trying to 'spoil' Apple's iPod Day 2008(tm)!!!

Man, Paul, you sure do get outraged over little things.  Who cares?  Even if MS WAS trying to divert attention... it wouldn't work.

:) Funny, but it's funnier to see how much some ppl loves you Paul. I just don't get it, they hates you / your blog and even hates Microsoft, but they still stay here. Sadism/Masoquism or something? ;)

I think that this is Paul's attempt at humor...settle down people.

Oh, and Ocean...at least Yert maintains his own blog instead of attempting to hijack Paul's.

--tayme

Whatever Paul likes to think, these people are right in that Microsoft would love to "steal Apple's thunder", seeing that Microsoft are so bad at making a product and then communicating what it does.

tayme

It IS, afterall, tagged with the "humor" tag.

It is odd that the same people who say, "Get over it, it's funny" about the "Get a Mac" ads seem to have no sense of humor about Apple.

I just keep thinking...

PC User: "Two Mac users walk into a bar..."

Mac User (interrupting): "That's not funny!"

<<It IS, afterall, tagged with the "humor" tag. <<

...and "Apple".

>>attempting to hijack Paul's.<<

Interesting concept.  When have you ever seen a 'Ocean' post on the front page?  I'd call that hijacking.  The majority of Paul's readers never even consider the comments.

Ocean

Yes it IS tagged with Apple as well as humor. It's also tagged with Windows Live.

That's because it's "humor" about "Apple" and "Windows Live".

The key part being IT'S HUMOR.

Nice spin.

Don't make yourself dizzy.

"PC User: "Two Mac users walk into a bar..."

Mac User (interrupting): "That's not funny!""

Heh... yeah, it can get like that on this site.  But it does come from this general position of weird umbrage taking on Paul's part.  I think the problem is that Paul really isn't a very good humorist.  Honestly.  His brand of "satire" doesn't translate into text, hence the tonal difference between this site and his podcasts.

It is kind of silly for Mac sites to get up in arms about a Mouse announcement on Spet 9th... but it's also an interest coincidence.  What makes sept 9th so special?

What are you Paul? Twelve?

I mean, seriously.

"but it's also an interesting coincidence.  What makes sept 9th so special?"

Nothing, and that's Paul's point.  A casual observer of the Mac centric sites may come off with the impression that MS is the big bad evil empire just dying to usurp Apple at any point possible.  Considering that these are two totally different types of products, the comparison by the Mac site is pointless and just meant to drive page views, which it seems it has done.

If one was to consider that there is some reason for the coincidence, the only logical coincidence would be Apple releasing an update to the unMightly Mouse, and that information was somehow leaked to both the Mac columnist and to MS who then was trying to steal their thunder.  But believing in such a coincidence would be just plain nutty.

johnpapola

"What makes sept 9th so special?"

A few things.

First, both the new Windows Live Video service has a sidebar gadget that uses stuff from the LifeCam webcams. The webcams and the mice both come from the same group at Microsoft so they're probably doing a single press event for all their new products for the holiday shopping season.

Next. Announcements from almost all major companies (in all industries) are done on Tuesdays. You don't want to announce on Monday or you get lost in people catching up after the weekend. That said, you want to announce as early in the week as possible so you get the longest news cycle. That's why Tuesdays are so universal (and why Friday is when you announce things you want ignored - hence the name "take out the trash day" as popularized on The West Wing.

Third, you don't have announcements during late December or right after 3-day weekends so that leaves you with about 45 possible Tuesdays.

Fourth, if you are announcing a product geared for the holiday shopping season, you need to announce it between September 1st and mid-October but don't want to announce when people are still traveling from Labor Day. This year that means you have 9/9, 9/16, 9/23, 9/30, 10/ 7, 10/14. That's it.

Fifth, if you also want to hit the last of the "back to school" market, you have to announce as early in September as possible. (and even that's iffy). That means 9/9 or 9/16 are your only possible dates and 9/9 is by far your best choice.

Good post Sir Michael.

Thats a real rarity for you in this thread.  :)

Ocean

That's really just Marketing 101 and most of it was thought out about a century ago by Thomas Watson Sr. who founded IBM. (Who always announce on Tuesdays)

btw: I'd also expect General Foods and GE and Hasbro and Krups and Kitchenaid and Nikon to make announcments on the 9th or 16th. I guess they're part of the conspiracy to steal Apple's thunder, too.

(Seriously, just about every company that sells through the retail channel and has holiday season products will make announcements on at least one of the 6 Tuesdays and most will make announcements on several of them.)

I've never studied marketing.

Ocean

Neither did I but you learn things whether you officially study them or not.  (If not, I'd be programming in Fortran)

I spent 2 1/2 years consulting to IBM back when they were still the world's dominent computer company and it was pretty much impossible back then not to pick up some Watsonisms.

Rule #3 for being a good Apple fanatic:

Poking at Apple is to be met with righteous indignation and fury.

You are free to poke at other companies without fear of being hypocrites.

Master3

What are rules 1, 2 and 4?

"Grow up, Paul."

"Paul, you're obsessed. This can't be healthy."

"Pulitzer prize winning journalism."

"Man, Paul, you sure do get outraged over little things.  Who cares?  Even if MS WAS trying to divert attention... it wouldn't work."

"Whatever Paul likes to think, these people are right in that Microsoft would love to "steal Apple's thunder", seeing that Microsoft are so bad at making a product and then communicating what it does."

"What are you Paul? Twelve?

I mean, seriously."

:-)

And this wasn't even about Apple. It was a post about some Mac sites.

@Shark Not about Apple?  Even thought title of the blog post is... "Microsoft continues trying to 'spoil' Apple's iPod Day 2008(tm)!!!"

You are right its about "Nothing".  It flame bait to drive posts.  

I dont think for one second MS is trying to do what is rumored.  Why?  Because they cant.  Now if they could, as in had some announcement that would make people listen over the new iTunes/iPod event, then it would NOT surprise me at all if MS did something like that.

Although I did see a new title today that described IE8 as having a "Porn Mode" and thought that was funny.

@mikegalos

#1 Everything Apple does is just and right. Do not doubt what we do. It is for your own good.

#2 As an Apple user, you are proven to be not only a smarter tech user, you are also automatically more creative, clever, cooler. Seek out your fellow Apple users and reaffirm your higher status and renew your pledge to the company.

#4 Only Apple is creative and original. Always look at what non Apple companies have made and find how they have stolen ideas from Apple. If you cannot find anything, remember that Apple will do it soon and thus it will be better than what exist. Feel free to express that without fear.

Master3,

Thanks. I just don't get my iCabal monthly check and update anymore so I wasn't sure I was up to date.

Lindy,

It's related to this:

www.macworld.co.uk/.../index.cfm

@Lindy - "Why?  Because they cant."

They sure seem to have your attention, though...

I read somewhere that this new "mouse" or, as MS likes to call them, Human Interface Devce, is going to be a GPS enabled wireless device that is accurate to within 2 nanometers. It will double as a TomTom type device for your travel needs, and has enough memory to store detailed maps of the entire known universe, incuding Canada.

--tayme

tayme,

"I read somewhere that this new "mouse" or, as MS likes to call them, Human Interface Devce, is going to be a GPS enabled wireless device that is accurate to within 2 nanometers. It will double as a TomTom type device for your travel needs, and has enough memory to store detailed maps of the entire known universe, incuding Canada."

Nonsense. That's just a rumor spread by the evil Canadians. Canada will NOT be included.

To add some real content, Microsoft does not call mice "Human Interface Devices". HIDs are actually a larger class of virtualized devices that includes mice.

Microsoft calls a Mouse... wait for it...  a mouse.

Shocking, I know.

Since we're talking humor and marketing, how about this?  It made me laugh and it shows where MS' marketing chops are at:

*You Can't Pay People to Use Microsoft Search*

Microsoft has been desperately trying to chip away at Google’s dominance in search -- and the ad coin it brings in -- but it looks like its plan to pay searchers isn't having much impact on market share.

In May, Microsoft unveiled its cashback search service, which gives users rebates on purchases that have been made through Live.com.

As TechCrunch’s Erick Schonfeld points out, a small initial boost in Microsoft’s search share in June nearly evaporated by July.

@Master:

Rule #3 for being a good Apple fanatic:

Poking at Apple is to be met with righteous indignation and fury.

You are free to poke at other companies without fear of being hypocrites.

You forgot to mention the addendum to the rule: When you read a blog post or an article that pokes fun at Apple or a Mac site, first attack the credibility and the intelligence of the author. If that doesn't work, post a link to an irrelevant article or blog post that pokes fun at Microsoft.

As an FYI, we're not talking about the average Mac user here -- just the fanatics -- so, please don't get your p in a b about this.

Yes, Mike...I am fully aware that HIDs can be mice, keyboards, or anything else that is used to input information into the system. No need to explain every little thing. That is as annoying as "lotsa" and his [sic] bombs used to be.

--tayme

@tayme How is that MS has my attention?  I read various IT sites daily, simply because I am in IT and support MS products for a living.  I have read Paul for years.

Step outside of work related MS activities and MS only gets my attention when I turn on my 360, which is not often anymore.  Its the only MS product that I have ever purchased.

@Lindy - "How is that MS has my attention?"

I believe that your posts here demonstrate that well. But, you could be right...it is really Paul that has your attention for Microsoft.

--tayme

So, MS pays for the food on your table, but you dislike the company's products. You dislike Windows enough to laugh at Windows users when fake news about Vista's entire security model collapsing comes out.

Not an enviable situation to be in, seriously.

Yes Paul has my attention....sometimes:)

"And this wasn't even about Apple. It was a post about some Mac sites."

I stand by my "obsessed" remark. This post is a good indication that Paul's really gone off the rails.

@shark.  I think Vista was pushed on consumers way to early.  MS has admitted as much, especially lately.  There is evidence from the internal emails (that paul even posted on this site) that they knew it shortly after it came out.

How could this happen?  Market dominance, monopoly like practices, and mountains of money to name a few.  So I think if bad press, and lots of it can teach MS not to pull that kind of move in the future then great.  I think other arrogantly, large companies can learn from their mistakes....even better.

They do make some great products, especially on the server side ("backoffice") of things and that is where anytime I spend with MS products is.  

MS does not pay me a dime.  My employers name is on my electronic pay stub that I open up on our corporate sharepoint site:)  

Lindy, fair enough. I'll try to remember it the next time I see something like this:

"while you are busy dumping Safari save some time and just format your Vista PC.

Beeeeeeeeeeeaaatch Slap that rang round the world.

...

Dam that is gut busting funny.  Enough to make Microsoft Mikey have a hissy fit.

Flame on MS fangirls!!!

Asta LaVISTA:)"

"Burn it to the ground and start over."

"Tears run down my face this is so funny!!!"

BTW, is Ocean some kind of bot?

Lindy:

The most obvious issues with Vista at launch time could be attributed almost entirely to third party vendors and partners of MSFT, who dragged their sorry asses in providing proper driver support.

True, MSFT could have waited a year or more for these laggards to get their act together, but what is the guarantee that they would have been ready a year later, when they didn't get up to speed with nearly two years of tech previews (alpha/beta/RC1/RC2 etc.)?

Other than the third party support issues, there were not many serious issues with the OS that any other new OS doesn't have. Leopard launch wasn't bug-free either, was it?

@Mike

"Neither did I but you learn things whether you officially study them or not.  (If not, I'd be programming in Fortran)"

Well, I 'm an old guy, but when the world needs number crunching, FORTRAN (of course it's supposed to be all caps ;)  ) is still used a lot:

www.spec.org/.../benchmarks

I helped get one of those Fortran/MPI programs into the spec suite, and the process gave me a lot more respect for that benchmark.

And since we're tagging humor:

www.pbm.com/.../real.programmers.html

chuckb84

Thanks. I hadn't seen "Real Programmers Don't Use Pascal" in a long time. A true classic.

Oh, and they changed the name from FORTRAN to Fortran in the ANSI X3.198-1992 (Fortran 90) spec.

:-)

@Mike,

Thanks for the incites on the groups inside Microsoft.  Yeah, tuesdays are the best announcement days.  And this is certainly likely to be a coincidence... especially since the Apple side of this date is JUST A RUMOR!

The Macworld article was just dumb pandering to mac fanboys.  No question.  But it was the exact kind of pandering that Paul sometimes does here.   They he continued this thread with another post is what makes it a little over-the-top.  It's almost like Paul saw that silly article, went to bed thinking about it... and then saw this post and felt compelled to follow up.  This single dumb article was worth 24 hours of thought by anyone.

That's just a little weird.  It's a mountain out of a stupid molehill.  And where it gets aggravating (I guess) for someone like myself is that Paul seems to point these things out in the particular and then expand them to the general.  He doesn't confine his criticism to Macworld.  He says:

"Here's a beautiful example of the Apple fanboy world seeing everything through Apple-colored lenses. "

No, the whole Apple fanboy world didn't post this, Paul.  Macworld did.  Extrapolating the general from the specific or the anecdotal is a kind of bigotry.  It's not rational, reasonable or fair.  And Paul does it all the time (iCabal).

but whatever.

incite = insight.  duh.

Why does "iCabal" irritate you?

Are you denying the existence of a group of Linux/OS X users that detests Microsoft? I agree that there are people who hate Apple too, but I think the number of people in the former group is higher.

I don't see many posts or comments directed at Apple on Windows specific sites like Liveside.net and bink.nu, among others. On the other hand, any article on a so called "technology agnostic" site that mocks/attacks Apple will have at least one person attack the credibility of the author or redirect the attack at Microsoft.

Very, very O/T (more than Ocean's posts):

Manual Transmissions seem to be a better value than even Hybrids based on the numbers in the latest Consumer Reports edition. I'm surprised so many Americans still prefer Automatic Transmissions.

Sorry. Had to get that out of the way. I love Manual Transmissions. :-)

@Raaj  I just set through a recent TechEd event, where MS listed off all of the things they screwed up in Vista.  The list was not short.  

Yes they got to a part about third party driver support and on this one I am on the side of MS.

Did Leopard have problems when it shipped, sure ALL SOFTWARE does.  That said no major problems that I know of if you did a clean install, as in format you drive.  There were people that had went over the top of Tiger and had software that caused problems with Leopard.  98% of those problems were known, and if the users had checked to see of their apps were compatible then the problems could have been avoided.  This also true of Vista over XP....or any OS over another.  If you have been in IT for a while, you will know the last thing you want to do is go over the top with a new OS.

Why is everyone bashing on Paul when this is actually how Apple fan boys act like in reality?

Because we all know Microsoft fan-boys are the models of decorum...

"Why is everyone bashing on Paul when this is actually how Apple fan boys act like in reality?"

That's pretty much how all zealots act. It's just that you don't recognize lunacy when you're the lunatic yourself.

Again, extrapolating a general view for all from the specific or the anecdotal instance of one or even many is a kind of bigotry.  It's certain intellectual fraud.  That's why it bothers me.

"all" people do this.  "nobody" does that.  Wrong and wrong.

I don't give a rats behind about the new iPods but the Live stuff in general is great and getting better. I dumped G Calender for the Live Calender it seems slightly more featured.

As for Ipods,  itunes just told me it won't copy the 100+ songs I purchased from them because I'm not authorized?? Is this because I continue to refuse to download the latest bloatware from them? I despise itunes and ALL DRM garbage.

Its all Amazon Store for me maybe Rhapsody is worth a try, anyone ever use that?

@whiplash - I have used Rhapsody for thier subscription based music in the past...It was OK, but I traded my Zen in for a Zune and now use the Zune Pass subscription. Rhapsody was a little slow and resource hungry on the PC that I was using at the time. Every now and again, I would get timeouts in the middle of syncing to the device. In fact, sometimes it would lock the entire PC up and I would have to hard boot.

--tayme

Okay, so Microsoft is trying to challenge Apple in the PR department. Good idea but again, the better Windows news should have been this.

Microsoft powered DNCC goes off without a hitch.

38 Million people watch final day of DNCC.

No BSOD's at DNCC.

I think that should have been the biggest PR success for Microsoft along with the Beijing Olympics. A beautiful presentation, excellent web streaming, and the launch of one of the most important political campagins in recent memory.

So Kudos for Microsoft. Perhaps Apple should be scared. However this spoiler day isn't worth the time. Lets move on.

Later.

launch of one of the most important political campaigns? what are you on about?

I would consider the presidential race one of the most important political campaigns, especially the situation the U.S. is in, very important. Thats what I mean.

gorath

Both the Democratic and Republican Convention sites use the same Microsoft technology for their steaming and on-demand video that was developed for the Olympics.

That may not seem like as big a deal as the Olympics but remember that Barack Obama's acceptance speech had higher ratings than the opening ceremonies of the Bejing Olympics.

Now that's proper network planning. Who would have anticipated that more people would watch a 45 minute political speech than the finale of American Idol, the Olympic opening ceremonies or the Oscars? Apparently, Microsoft.

Oh I see.

I had no idea (and still don't actually know) what DNCC is/was. All I know is that subzero mentioned it in the same post as the olympics.

So, I thought the two were some kind of linked issue. Obviously not.

Anyway, I have no interest in American politics (no disrespect), so....

carry on.

@sub and Mike, what exactly did MS have to do with the 38millions TV viewers?  TV viewers that viewed the broadcast via 4+ different networks.

Sure you could probably watch it online, from those same broadcasters, and maybe NBC for sure used the MS technology.

Lindy

The demand for online viewing of content is generally proportional to the demand for TV viewing of  the content. Since pretty much nobody was expecting the TV viewing demand to be anywhere near that level, the proportionate online demand is also likely to be unexpectedly large.

It you watch it online (in real time or on demand later) from the official party sites you're getting the Microsoft viewing technology.

@gorath,

None taken. I'm a political junkie and I want our country to better than it has been getting in terms of our tear down politics. I'd like to see people do better than they are now. Plus I'm very impressed with Microsoft's seamless presentation of the DNCC and hope the Republicans get the same treatment.

Yes, I'm biased for the Dems. But I can be fair, since I've met both Obama and McCain personally. I can also analyze things objectively and thats how I decided on Obama vs. McCain.

Later.

While I am sure the demand to view it online is high, and continues after the fact I think MS is just one of many technologies/providers.

I would say the breakdown probably goes like this....

1.  38 million TV viewers live on 4-6 prime time/cable news shows, in the US.

2.  Live broad casts of event outside of the US on cable news (CNN, FOX, MSNBC) who knows how many

3.  Tivo/DVR/PVR of 1 and 2 at some later point.  (I did this with the Biden's presentation)

4.  Re-broad casts on the above, (I just say the McCain/Obama Pastor Rick last night on cable news replayed).

5. Online broadcasts, to include all news organizations listed in #1 (I missed Bill Clinton but caught him on www.cnn.com later that night).  Also both parties HQ's online use MS technology.  Also youtube of course.  Hundreds of little no name news/blog sites linked back to youtube/cablenews/DNC HQ.

Sure MS is doing a great job, minus the fact they jam silver light up your *** to view stuff, but they are in NO WAY responsible for delivering probably even 20% of content viewed.

Actually, there were several speeches that I caught because I fell asleep. I had to watch Biden's and Bill Clinton's speech at about 3 am CST, through the DNCC website. If you check the DNCC website, you'll see that the official Software and HD Web Content provider was Microsoft.

So that means, all of the HD web content was delivered by MIcrosoft, so you're comment doesn't hold up. Second, it was much higher quality than the NBC content, so I'll give Microsoft credit for that too.

Also, PBS broadcasted the DNCC speech but they didn't pay the Nielsen Corp for the ratings. According to PBS, approximately 4 million watched through their network. So thats 38.4 million plus 4 equals approximately 42.4 million viewers. Thats a pretty good chunk of the American viewership. Not bad for a junior senator from Illinois.

btw: for anyone interested in the Microsoft technology in use at the two conventions there's a paper on that up at www.microsoft.com/.../08-19conventions.mspx