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Paul,

Actually, it was Kit Ong who reported it first:

geekswithblogs.net/.../125702.aspx

Pingback from  topwebbusinesses  » Blog Archive   » Windows Strata?

Nicely done name. A word meaning either layer or paved road and tied to clouds.

Windows Strata: A paved road to the Windows layer of cloud computing.

Now, of course, the real question is whether pedantic geeks like me will debate pronunciation of the first "a"...

(Of course we will)

A little OT, but can 32 bit Vista SP1 see 4 GB RAM? I can buy it  cheaply for the cheapo ACER laptop, or can just swap one 1GB stick for a 2GB stick, but that may disable dual channel.

Wae, were are you? The Guru cannot take vacation without permission!!!

It sounds like MS is trying to drum up anticipation for PDC in several different ways. Good job!!!

--tayme

tayme

As I've been saying for months now, this year's PDC/WinHEC combo is game changing.

Windows "7", Live Mesh, whatever Windows Strata turns out to be...

Between PDC, WinHEC, the US elections and my birthday it's going to be an interesting two weeks.

Let's hope they can avoid using Nimbus or one if its combining forms.

And Mike is right, this will be a very important PDC and a very important WinHEC.  (Possibly the former will be more important.)

I don't do conferences (for that matter, I haven't flown since about 1993).

DRWAM, you can use 4GB with Vista SP1, it should see all of it. Installing different sized DIMMs (e.g. 1GB and 2GB) should not disable dual channel mode.

animositysomina

It's a little more complex than that since on 32-bit there can be video RAM overlay taking up some of the address space.

(Of course, the real solution is to go 64-bit...)

Can you upgrade from Vista Ultimate 32bit to 64bit?

mikegalos, at least Vista SP1 says in its system stats window that 4GB of RAM is installed, which I heard was impossible to see in pre-SP1. I guess once DRWAM sees this soothing message he'll be happy. No need for him to know dirty details :-) Of course x64 is better in this case, I totally agree.

This was a reason why I installed 3GB RAM into my Dell Vostro with Vista 32-bit. Why install 4GB if some of it will be wasted? I'm too lazy to migrate to x64 and 3GB is plenty for Vista anyway.

I suggest DRWAM to follow my steps and install 3GB in his Acer. He won't lose dual channel and he won't lose any memory due to address space limitations in 32-bit Windows.

shark47, no, as far as I know upgrade between 32-bit and 64-bit versions of Windows is technically impossible. You'll have to do clean install

shark, you can with two caveats.  First, you will need to do a clean install, and you will need to get the 64 bit media, which if you search hard enough you can find for purchase for a delivery charge.

Dipsh

If you have retail full package product then you got DVDs for both 32-bit and 64-bit (At least I did on my pre-SP1 copy of Ultimate that I just checked)

Hehe, Dipsh's first caveat turns upgrade into clean install, just like I said

3GB it is! [or will be at least] Thanks, and sorry for the OT but there's a sale, and you all know that I like to go cheap on my tech stuff:)

Doc

Would love 64 bit, but I'm not sure if this would handle it. Besides, the idea was to spend less for the kids laptop...er, I mean wife's laptop now! But to get more performance for a few more pennies is just to tempting to pass, so I must... cannot....trying , but not succeeding to resist!!!

"Now, of course, the real question is whether pedantic geeks like me will debate pronunciation of the first "a"..."

What's to debate? Latin word, latin pronunciation.

I want to see Windows SkyNet....

Mum

I know it's "a as in state or plate" but I suspect we'll hear a lot of "a as in hat or cat".

And I really doubt we'll see stratæ as the plural.

:-)

Since it's MS product name or code name or whatever...I am thinking that they can pronounce it as they please...no debate to be had.

--tayme

FYI, in case you do want to debate, Strata is already a plural...see dictionary.reference.com/.../strata

"Strata, historically the plural of stratum, is occasionally used as a singular: The lowest economic strata consists of the permanently unemployable. Less frequently, a plural stratas occurs: Several stratas of settlement can be seen in the excavation. At present, these uses are not well established, and they are condemned in usage guides. Strata may eventually become part of a group of borrowed plurals that are now used as singulars in English, such as agenda and candelabra, but it is not yet in that category."

--tayme

"Since it's MS product name or code name or whatever...I am thinking that they can pronounce it as they please...no debate to be had."

Yes, because whatever Microsoft does IS the standard. Right, "waethorn"?

meason said:

I want to see Windows SkyNet....

I'm sorry, but meason wins todays funny bone award. You're terminated!:)

strata is one of those odd collective words that can be both singular or plural

The plural of stratum is strata

The plural of strata is stratæ

For example, the strata at site A is much thinner than the strata at site B but both these stratæ are thinner than the strata at site C.

Pedantic enough, yet?

:-)

DRWAM

Really, everyone knows it'll be Windows Live SkyNet...

But is stratæ acceptable in the English language? We need an English professor, I think.

Of course, Mike is always right...in his opinion anywho.

--tayme

tayme

The reason I'm right so often is I do the homework. (I looked it up before posting)

If your notebook has integrated graphics going with 3gig of RAM (1 -1gig, 1-2gig) you video performance may suffer.  

That is because "Dual Channel" configuration is only possible when both memory slots have the same size/speed memory sticks.  So either 2 1gig, or 2 2gig sticks.

Integrated graphics dont have dedicated video memory like a dedicated video card, so they use the slower system memory, made even slower in single channel mode.

Vista will see between 3.26 - 3.5gig.  Its worth in IMHO to just go with 4gig.  Now if that notebook has a dedicated GPU, my points are mute.

en.wikipedia.org/.../Dual-channel_architecture

bettieblu, your Wikipedia article states that "it is not required that identical modules be used, but this is often recommended for best compatibility", hence you can't guarantee that DRWAM's notebook will NOT work in dual channel mode with 3GB RAM.

It turns out that for another $10, I can get two 2GB sticks, and I have a friend buying the same laptop. I'll try both and if I see no big difference, I'll give him a stick. He writes the docs schedules so it's good to keep him happy with me. Plus he's one heck of a great guy and one of the founders of the group.

OK, so give me a link for a good test for it...please.

Thanks,

Doc

PS  Mike, good follow up too! The wife got a chuckle as well.

Doc

"Pedantic enough, yet?

:-)"

Not really. You have to go nucular to be really pedantic.

Think different. Go nucular.

<I know it makes no sense :-)>

You are right.  Its not required just recommended, but every example they use shows two modules of the same size.  It also warns about different speeds.

It only matters if the notebook has integrated graphics.  Dual Channel for the most part is a nice but only gives you a small boost in speed, unless you have integrated graphics and the article says up to a 25% performance hit.  With Vista that is not good, if you have Aero turned on.  

I have tested this with my wife's notebook.  I initially went to 3gig of RAM, from 2gig with Vista and in that configuration her video score dropped to 1.5 from 3.2.  I went to 4gig and it went back up.  This was on a HP Pavilion notebook Intel everything (chipset, video, wireless).  I downloaded one of the MS HD videos, the one with the F-15 and ran it with both configurations, and did the whole Windows TAB at the same time.  The video would choke with 3gig of ram but ran fine even while doing the 3D Flip with 2 or 4 gig of RAM.

If money is the concern by all means go with 3gig.  That said I think for a cheap non-gaming notebook 32bit Vista should be fine with 2gig of RAM.  I cant imagine buying that notebook for anything intensive.

If you want more RAM and you have integrated graphics, I would go with two identical modules to avoid any problems.  RAM is CHEAP.  Here is a matched set from Crucial, probably some of the best RAM around in terms of reliability and customer service, and its only $81.

www.newegg.com/.../Product.aspx

Shark. That word truly irritates me when I hear it. I was introduced a few times as a Nucular Radiologist. Arrg! I thought I heard Palin say it at the debate, too, twice, then pronouncing it correctly the third time. I guess I could be wrong, but it sure did sound like it. Double arrg! What's pleural for 'moose'?

www.microsoft.com/.../contentshowcase.aspx

Download the "Fighter Pilot" video.  Open a few things, IE, Word and play this movie.  Now do the whole 3D flip (windows key - tab) it should continue to play in the flip window.  It should get choppy if the PC is running in single channel mode.  Also do a performance test in Vista, right click My Computer, Properties.  You can do this now to see the Video raiting, probably around 3-3.5 while in Dual Channel mode.

Doc, the mispronunciation by Palin was intentional. She intentionally says 'nucular' and 'Iyraq' because it apparently helps her connect with 'Joe Six-pack'. She accidentally said 'nuclear' once during the debate before correcting herself. :-)

DRWAM

No question, Palin pronounced nuclear as nucular. I think it's considered a requirement to run for office as an RNC candidate.

And I believe a moose's pleura is similar to ours but larger... :-)

en.wikipedia.org/.../Nucular

Usage by politicians

U.S. presidents Dwight D. Eisenhower, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush, as well as Presidential Candidate Walter Mondale and Vice Presidential Candidate Sarah Palin, have all used this pronunciation.[5][6][7] [8]

@sharky - I guess Mike forgot to research that one...He said, "I think it's considered a requirement to run for office as an RNC candidate." and you list 3 Dems and 3 Republicans.

Come on Mike...now's your chance to finally admit that you are wrong. I know you can do it...

--tayme

tayme

I never said it wasn't optional for Democrats trying to get GOP votes, just that it was mandatory for the RNC.

1) All members of A are C

2) Some members of B are C

Given statements 1 and 2 you seem to think that statement 1 cannot be true if statement 2 is also true.

I'm guessing you either did badly on your SAT or forgot a lot of logic from listening to too much talk radio.

Perhaps a basic logic course might help.

"I know it's "a as in state or plate" but I suspect we'll hear a lot of "a as in hat or cat"."

Aaaaaaaargh, no way. It's "a" as in "star".

@Doc:

I've told numerous people about this before so it's not a strange question by any means:

1)  New systems support something called "asynchronous/asymmetric dual-channel" memory.  That means you CAN install RAM in un-like pairs.  It runs faster than single-channel, but slower than the standard synchronous dual-channel.

2)  64-bit versions of Windows will always be able to utilize a full 4GB of RAM, unless your video memory is shared.  32-bit versions will be able to address up to 4GB of address space, so hardware resources will always take up a portion of that (usually 1/2 to 7/8's of a GB).

3)  Vista SP1 will reports the INSTALLED RAM, not the usable RAM, which is going to be less on a 32-bit system.  Vista RTM reports the usable RAM, which is the amount of installed RAM minus hardware resource allocation and shared video memory.

4)  The performance benefits in Vista of going from 2GB of synchronous dual-channel to 3GB of async dual-chan will be minimal, and isn't worth the extra money.

5)  Given point 4, going from 2GB to anything above is really only a big deal on 64-bit versions of Windows.  If it's 32-bit, don't expect it to be a performance notebook, so stick with 2GB and save a few bucks.

6)  Your Acer notebook came with Windows, so only Acer supports it.  You'd have to contact them if you want a 64-bit install DVD.  They would have to support it on that model before they'll provide one though, so your chances of getting one are slim.  Microsoft doesn't support OEM versions, so you can't order a replacement disc from them.

7)  Retail versions of Vista (except for Ultimate) come in ONLY 32-bit versions.  You can order 64-bit media from Microsoft for RETAIL VERSIONS ONLY.  Ultimate comes with both discs in a retail package (only).

8)  Next time, if you want to be able to upgrade to 4GB, look for a notebook that ships with the 64-bit.  Ask for a product demo in the store if the sales reps don't know (they usually don't have a clue in the first place).  Check under System Properties to see - press the WinKey + Pause/Break to get to System Properties.  It will say if it's 32-bit or 64-bit.

Hope that helps.

@bettie:

RAM speed won't affect video performance unless it's "onboard" video, i.e. built into the chipset and using shared video memory.

Discrete graphics cards aren't affected by the test.

"I know it's "a as in state or plate" but I suspect we'll hear a lot of "a as in hat or cat"."

Considering that nobody pronounces "stratosphere" (the most common use of the word) as "stray-tosphere", it would stand to reason that that would be correct.

Thanks gang. You are all the best. I owe you all a drink. If you need drugs or just want to sell them them to wall street buttheads [ especially the suicidal ones or any one at AIG or Lehman], just let me know as I have a script pad ready:)

"If you need drugs or just want to sell them them to wall street buttheads [ especially the suicidal ones or any one at AIG or Lehman]"

LOL!  Don't need any - I grow my own.  ;)

I'd like to be on about the 10th floor of one of those buildings, watching all the 30th-floor accountants whizzing past the window.  :P

Pingback from  Windows Strata ??????????????? Windows Cloud OS? | LiveSino - LiveSide ?????????

Pingback from  Windows Strata ??????????????? Windows Cloud OS? | LiveSino - LiveSide ?????????

Pingback from  Windows Strata ??????????????? Windows Cloud OS? | LiveSino - LiveSide ?????????

Pingback from  Windows Strata ??????????????? Windows Cloud OS? | LiveSino - LiveSide ?????????

If the execs at AIG are suicidal, they're sure doing a good job of hiding it.

BTW, is this statement accurate:

"Server 2008 is slightly newer than Vista and would be acceptable as a server (obviously) or as a lighter weight gaming/ desktop platform than Vista. By default, a lot of the bloat that was in Vista is disabled by default in Server 2008. However, if you want, Server 2008 can basically be transformed into full featured Vista. So if want to install legit Windows on another machine, give this a look. "

forumst.slickdeals.net/showthread.php

It funny you mention it, as someone at the forum actually installed it on this laptop:

forumst.slickdeals.net/showthread.php

"a lot of the bloat that was in Vista is disabled by default in Server 2008"

Actually counters this statement:

"if you want, Server 2008 can basically be transformed into full featured Vista"

It can't be, actually, and it requires a lot of work to get it even close.  Server 2008 suffers from another type of "bloat", and that's all the server services running in the background.  Paul already talked about the silliness of such claims, as did Ed Bott.  They are the same codebase.  Performance due to services isn't an argument because those services can be turned off in Vista.

With computers coming with Windows Vista now, what's the point?

"someone at the forum actually installed it on this laptop"

Ok, that's just dumb.  For one thing, you can't use standard power management stuff on mobile computers in Server 08 because it doesn't include the same functionality as Vista in that regards.

Sorry, Mike...but again, you are wrong. I can name many current and past GOP members of the Senate and Congress that do not pronounce it Nucular, thus your statement "it was mandatory for the RNC." is incorrect, wrong, flawed. Your sampling was much too small and unbalanced. Much like the samplings of the current polls regarding the 2008 Presidential election.

Nice try, though. Come on, Mike...say it. 3 short, 1 syllable words - "I WAS WRONG" Most of us are able to do that...Heck, even John McCain did regarding the Keating 5 (by the way, of which 4 were Dems) fiasco...and Barack Obama cannot even tell us why he continually associates himself with questionable characters such as Bill Ayers and Reverand Wright. Its not about whether he condones or denounces what they did or said...just that he has a habit of long term relationships with them.

Not that I think that McCain is the right person for the job...just that he is the lesser or 2 evils at this point.

--tayme

"I can name many current and past GOP members of the Senate and Congress that do not pronounce it Nucular, thus your statement "it was mandatory for the RNC." is incorrect, wrong, flawed."

There are 2 omissions with that statement:

First, proof.

Second, it still doesn't explain the fact that Republicans are idiots.

Well, the presidential candidate says 'Nuclear':

www.youtube.com/watch

:)

"Not that I think that McCain is the right person for the job...just that he is the lesser or 2 evils at this point."

Sure, pick the WHITE GUY!  :P

Did you honestly see McCain in the previous debate?  I turned it on for about 5 minutes just for a laugh and he was shuffling around the stage like he was suffering from a bout of incontinence (Doc knows what I'm talking about).

If he can make a mess of his pants that easily, then the US is doomed!

"Get that guy some slippers and a housecoat"....

...."and a fresh adult diaper!"

@Waethorn - Not being from the US, I assume that you are ignorant of the facts and not just ranomly poking fun at a guy who has been permantly injured? Nice...

--tayme

@Waethorn - Do you REALLY need me to provide proof that not every past and present member of the GOP pronounces it Nucular? If so, then provide proof that we Republicans are all idiots...BTW, use the medical definition, not the one that is just used as an insult...

"A person of the lowest order in a former classification of mental retardation, having a mental age of less than three years old and an intelligence quotient under 25. "

--tayme

You all need to stick to the topic...just like I do ;)

...of answering all my questions, that is.

I love this blog!

@Mike

I heard if you activated the 32 bit version of Ultimate you could never activate the 64bit version. Do you, or does anyone know if this is the case? I'd like to uninstall the 32 bit version and use the 64 bit version on my next build.

Thanks for any help you can give.

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