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I've been playing with Mesh for a while now, and I really like how it works.  Yet every time I mention it to one of my co-workers their reaction is always the same...they all have fear over security concerns.  I have to admit that it does feel strange having machines "hooked together" like that via the internet, but to see so many people question the security of it makes me think that cloud computing still has a long way to go before people really embrace it.  

It's about time they integrate with SkyDrive.

Can't wait!

I've been using Live Mesh for quite some time now. It simplifies so much of my day-to-day file transfers.  It's also great for backup, as Paul mentioned, which is great for me because I frequently reinstall/install Windows on different computers and this, along with a couple other "cloud" based services that I use, makes the process so much quicker and simpler.

@fzanes

I get the same response from people that I recommend it to.  It's a shame really, because I've never had any security issues with online data (that I can recall anyways).  I probably wouldn't recommend it to someone who needs ultra-secure file storage, but the average Joe should have no problem.

meh, the dropbox sync client, itunes home sharing, and windows7 homegroups have been addressing these needs in the constant vacuum of live mesh's 'promise' for quite some time.    

LiveMesh is very cool in theory.

I had some issues with it in practice, relatively minor though.

I am looking forward to when they get this working closer to 100% as it's very cool.

I am also looking forward to them picking a freaking name for this stuff and just sticking with it!

I love, love love dropbox.

Here is a negative to Live Mesh:

"As far as I can tell, Live Mesh doesn’t have plans to support a revision system like DropBox. I think this is a horrible, horrible mistake. Having a file on multiple machines provides nice redundancy, yet if you accidentally delete a file on one computer, Live Mesh will happily delete every copy of it."

www.ytechie.com/.../convenient-synchronization-with-mesh-and-dropbox.html

One of the biggest things that will make WL Wave 4 better than other web services is not having inline ads in personal videos.  That's the point where YouTube has nearly become unusable because of Google.

@Ocean:

"if you accidentally delete a file on one computer, Live Mesh will happily delete every copy of it"

Wrong.  Files deleted from Mesh-synced folders will still go to the local Recycle Bin on that PC.

"Files deleted from Mesh-synced folders will still go to the local Recycle Bin on that PC."

Sigh.

True or False:  Live Mesh has a file revisioning system

"Yeah, naming complexity continues to plague the Windows Live team..."

Understatement of the year.  IT people have a hard enough time keeping up with the Microsoft name changing game/many, many versions of the same thing.  Consumers at this point, if they even care, are hopelessly lost.

"I love, love love dropbox"  Ditto.  NOTHING compares to its flexibility.

@Wae....  www.hanselman.com/.../TechnicalPresentationsBePreparedForAbsoluteChaos.aspx

Go down to this heading "Your Presentation Has Been Deleted".  Sure his partner that moved the file had a copy on his machine, but the guy doing the presentation was efffffe'd because of no revision system.

techcrunch.com/.../eu-antitrust-google-microsoft

Rode-- good thing they recovered.  Dropbox is a lot more lightweight too.

Paul says he likes it for the built in remote desktop capabilities...but thats never been a huge deal for me.

I could not disagree more that FolderShare needs to die. While Live Mesh is great and I've used it from day one I do not want Live Mesh on Corporate machines however I may have need of a file transfer mechanism such as is found in Live Mesh. This is where FolderShare/Live Sync works perfectly and solves a problem many business users have.

Example: Home Building company outsources their CAD/Plans to a third party located a few hundred miles away. They need to get those files from the designer ASAP but do it in the easiest way possible that requires no special go here to download that or install this to get that crap. Simple solution is to setup FolderShare with a shared Folder on the Desktop of the remote user and one internal user. The Internet user can then receive those very large files without having to do a thing and we have not setup another potential security risk by allowing remote connectivity or remote desktop access.

Sorry but I think your thinking way to much on how you (Paul) use the products and not how others are using them.

What about WHS suport or just network paths.

@jctierney

The scenario I always hear is: What if a virus drops infected files in a synced folder on one machine, then all the machines that are set-up to synch will also get it.  I guess it's a possible scenario, but you just have to trust the people using the machines within your mesh I guess.  

I still use it all the time, and it works great for what I use it for.  I really think that's what's important here. People get so caught up in the "Brand" of the tool they are using, when what really matters is "does it work for you?"

'what really matters is "does it work for you?"'

Dropbox does.

http://www.getdropbox.com

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@Ocean

Ok, dropbox works for you, that's great.  Mesh works for me, and I have no other needs at this point so why would I change?  

Unlike you I don't get caught up with the Brand.  You have a stange compulsive aversion to Microsoft products that makes you look silly.  They are just tools man, they don’t define you.

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"You have a stange compulsive aversion to Microsoft products that makes you look silly."

Not at all.  I really like MS products and have expressed that several times here.

@Ocean,

1) You've never said anything remotely resembling a "favorable" opinion of anything Microsoft here that I've read (granted, I usually get bored with you 2-3 posts into the comments, and I don't waste the time to follow-up).

2) I do agree that revision history is important which is one reason I don't use it (in addition to not using SkyDrive for storage). However, it works great for a lot of people already, and the bigger point here is that it's not even officially "1.0" technology yet. I expect it to come in the future as the teams integrate and become more mature. As such, I see no reason to slam the service in the areas where it meets a need... and where it doesn't, I'd use an alternative. Nothing wrong with that at all.

Where did the world go wrong that we think our idea is the only right one with technology? Product A does this, and Product B does that... which one suits your need? OK, use it!

Yes ... But the real problem is we need a Win7 integration of Live Mesh and Sky drive...

Personally, if Microsoft don't integrate it in Window7 explorer I will keep with Dropbox...

"You've never said anything remotely resembling a "favorable" opinion of anything Microsoft here that I've read"

I use a MS operating system everyday.

Until recently, I used a windows mobile phone.  

Although I may purchase an iPad, my home will never be Microsoft-less.  In fact, that iPad will be my first non-MS PC.

"As such, I see no reason to slam the service"

I've not done that.

@Ocean, rrode:

Live Mesh doesn't do cloud-hosted file revisioning, but then, Office Live Workspace does.  Office Live Workspace is designed for hosting Office files and is entirely stable (for years, being based on SharePoint technologies), while Live Mesh is in beta.  Which one should they have used in a production environment?

I suggest you both rethink your IT discussions with intelligent points to begin with.

*I was referring to the issue where someone lost a PowerPoint document because someone else had access to it.

THe problem in the last version of Live mesh it is the explorer integration was useless with desktop refresh at all 5 seconds and with a useless right bar when you open a live mesh folder...

Microsoft! We need a simple Live mesh desktop integration like dropbox... something light and that we can forget... And that is invisible... Please keep it simple!!

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"We need a simple Live mesh desktop integration like dropbox... something light and that we can forget... And that is invisible"

Ya, you know, because we don't wanna know when files are on other computers that may or may not be shared with other people....

I tend to agree with Waethorn on this one. I have used Live Mesh...and I like it for what it is. It is not intended to be a version control tool. I also like knowing that I am putting data in the cloud and that it may or may not be secure(that is a different discussion).

At one time, I was using Live Mesh on a couple of Vista PCs and a Mac, and it worked great. Like others have said above, if the tool meets your needs, why p!ss and moan about the other available tools. Just keep on doing what you are doing, and maybe look at the competition to see if it meets your needs more thoroughly...unless of course, you are a simple minded brand loyalist.

--tayme

This update to live mesh is not a minute too soon, I was begining to wonder if was ever going to be finalised. There is a lot to like about it. I am also interested in checking out dropbox as a comparison.

"Office Live Workspace does. "

But thats not a sync tool.

The point is, this is an oversight on MS' part, and they'll end up correcting it.

"Microsoft! We need a simple Live mesh desktop integration like dropbox... something light and that we can forget... And that is invisible... Please keep it simple!!"

This.

"I am also interested in checking out dropbox as a comparison. "

The word is out.

My job is done.  :)

"This update to live mesh is not a minute too soon, I was begining to wonder if was ever going to be finalised."

....still isn't.  But it will be, RSN!

"Like others have said above, if the tool meets your needs, why p!ss and moan about the other available tools."

I'd like to take this time and point out that Dropbox only supports 2GB for free, while Office Live Workspace is 2.5 times the size....  ;)

I should also point out to Ocean and rrode that Dropbox is a beta application.  That is enough to keep it out of respectable IT toolboxes for the near future.

"But thats not a sync tool."

The execution may be different, but the goal is the same.

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Hoo!! I just try the latest Live Mesh version and now it is great!!

Do you think that Microsoft will merge SkyDrive and LiveMesh??

I have 25Gb in SkyDrive I hope they will convert it in live mesh!!

"I should also point out to Ocean and rrode that Dropbox is a beta application."

Lol so is mesh, so was Vista, so was Office 2007 until SP2.

"Dropbox is a beta application."

Only because they haven't removed the label.  Its in wide use, and has been for a long time.  

"The execution may be different, but the goal is the same."

No, I can't install an app from portableapps,com on Office Live Workspace and then have it automatically available for use anywhere I have sync setup.  No can do.

"Do you think that Microsoft will merge SkyDrive and LiveMesh??"

If they do they wont use either name, it will be something new like "LiveMagicDrive" just to confuse consumers into not using the products and piss off the shareholders.  Par for the course.

Wikipedia:  "As the Internet has allowed for rapid and inexpensive distribution of software, companies have begun to take a more loose approach to use of the word "beta"."

"In the context of Web 2.0, people even talk of perpetual betas to signify that some software is meant to stay in beta state. Also, "beta" is sometimes used to indicate something more like a release candidate "

en.wikipedia.org/.../Software_release_life_cycle

"It's kind of an arbitrary thing," Page said. "We could take beta off all of our products tomorrow, and we wouldn't actually have accomplished anything...If it's on there for five years because we think we're going to make major changes for five years, that's fine.

********It's really a messaging and branding thing.***********"

news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-141230.html

I've been using Mesh for a while on XP, Vista and Leopard/Snow Leopard. It is really useful to me. NOw that I can store stuff on my iPhone with Documents To Go, I need Mesh a little less. But when I need a file ASAP, Mesh provides it faster than emailing with Documents To Go. The Live services remind me of a free version of MobileMe. Maybe Zune Music integration will be next. I wish that the was an app for Mesh and Live services on the iPhone.

Wae,

www.dropbox.com/iphoneapp

"Lol so is mesh, so was Vista, so was Office 2007 until SP2."

So is the web app running the spam application that generated the email message with the link that provided you with your IT credentials.

@Ocean, rrode:  You've both proven your 1337 IT skillz, time and time again.  Beta applications aren't relevant to enterprise IT, and that's probably why most "web 2.0" services, OSS advocates, and "creative developers" (read: amateur Apple users that think they know anything about IT) use it.  Sorry, but you lose.

@Ocean:  Showing that there's an iPhone app for Dropbox proves MY point, not yours.

I wasn't trying to prove a point.  You expressed a need, I expressed one way to solve it.

The word 'beta' has devolved to be a marketing term.  Most savvvy IT shops recognize that.

Ocean, I thought that you were showing me the app, but mistakenly typed Wae. Anyway, thank you. That app is free, so I downloaded it and will keep it around. I have back up copies in multiples, so this will serve as another method of storing my 104 Nuclear Medicine protocols on line, as well as schedules and various dictation templates and crib notes.

Doc

@Wae you build w/shite box desktops for consumers in Canada, WTF do you know about enterprise IT....nothing.  You prove this every time you post.  FYI Mesh or any Live product is NOT an enterprise tool.  

I am also pretty sure Ocean or I did not ever say dropbox was an enterprise tool.

Now run along, they day is almost over and I hear in Canada Rotten Ronnies runs a 2 for 1 crap burger special on Wednesdays.  I would not want you miss out.  Dont forget to bring you Zune so you can get free wifi and squirt all over the person next to you.

"The word 'beta' has devolved to be a marketing term.  Most savvvy [sic] IT shops recognize that."

No.  "savvy" is what amateur Mac users call supposed IT people for choosing their at-home platform of choice for the enterprise.  Anybody with any IT sense knows that "beta" doesn't belong in the same sentence as another term.  That other term is "production environment".

(Sorry losta, you can't say I put them in the same sentence.  :-p  )

BTW, Ocean:  Savvy people know how to spell savvy.

Note to losta:  Savvy people know how to spell savvy without relying on an inline spell checker too.

"Ocean, I thought that you were showing me the app, but mistakenly typed Wae. Anyway, thank you. "

You're welcome.

Why is Wae so touchy today?

"you build w/shite box desktops for consumers in Canada, WTF do you know about enterprise IT"

Actually, we have a very successful server and IT consulting arm of our business as well.  Our split is about 60/40 for consumer/business.

"Mesh or any Live product is NOT an enterprise tool....I am also pretty sure Ocean or I did not ever say dropbox was an enterprise tool."

Hey, YOU'RE the one that brought up a business case for Windows Live Mesh with your example.  And then you brought up Dropbox as a replacement.  So what is it?  Are you apologizing for bringing up the wrong example?  Or are you apologizing for your suggested replacement for the wrong type of customer (which you've shown to do many times before, which I'm sure tayme would back me on)?

BTW:  You're getting defensive for no reason.  Live Mesh IS an IT tool - it's a part of the Azure services platform, so you can go ahead and apologize for getting that wrong too.

"they day is almost over and I hear in Canada Rotten Ronnies runs a 2 for 1 crap burger special on Wednesdays"

I can get a McDonalds Angus burger made from real Alberta Angus beef, with real cheddar cheese, lettuce, tomato, and mayo on a real Ciabatta bun.  In the US, the Angus burger is made from reconstituded Angus beef with twice the fat, on a lame sesame seed bun with processed cheese (that's what the rest of the world calls "American cheese", because that's what it is) and is sold as a "1/3rd pounder", making it encompass the characteristic of "obese American".  Face it: we've built a better mouse trap.  The difference is, we don't use the mouse in our burgers.

"reconstituded Angus beef"

Is this the same poster that ripped me for putting one too many v's in savvy?

Off-topic, but just putting it out there:  Heavy Rain is an awesome game, and it's only on PS3.  Take that, anyone that says that I'm one-sided pro-Microsoft!

Also, I preordered FF XIII.  The story looks epic and the characters memorable and emotional, unlike most of the games since FF VII.  Here's a look:  www.gametrailers.com/.../60730  

Note to game creators:  If you're going to choose a contemporary song as a "theme", interweave the melody throughout the game music to keep some kind of synnergy throughout all of the musical elements.  That's what works for film.  I don't mind using something like Leona Lewis (certainly better than the 80's-style J-pop stuff in the Japanese version, which just doesn't work in the Western world), but it would be better if they wrote most of the emotional cinematic music with the same melody to unify it, as it is in the trailer.  There's a reason why they call it a "theme", after all.

My example?  No it was from Ocean's Link.  I was just helping him make his point...by reading the link.  The point being that drop box does versioning.  The example was of some programmer that gave a speech some place and went to get his presentation from mesh but it was gone, because his buddy dragged the presentation off of mesh onto his computer and it was gone from mesh.

None of these are enterprise tools as they stand today.  Mesh might be an example of what can be done with Azure, but mesh is a pure beta aimed at enthusiasts.

The details you know about McDonalds is hilarious.  Is your whitebox store front like one of those dual gas station/McDonalds only your store front is the gas station?  Do you own both sides?  Rotten Ronnie's is poison, in the US or Canada.  I would not eat there unless I had too.

"Is this the same poster that ripped me for putting one too many v's in savvy?"

I only said "Savvy people know how to spell savvy".  I made no other inferred claims by that statement.

"My example?  No it was from Ocean's Link.  I was just helping him make his point..."

There's your classic backtracking again.  Here's what really happened:

"rr0de74@live.com said:

@Wae....  www.hanselman.com/.../TechnicalPresentationsBePreparedForAbsoluteChaos.aspx"

Go ahead.  Apologize:  www.youtube.com/watch

"Rotten Ronnie's is poison, in the US"

That's the only part of that sentence that's true.

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I will go S   L   O   W   F   O  R   Y  O  U.  The schools you attended probably were not so great in Canada.

Ocean linked this article.....

www.ytechie.com/.../convenient-synchronization-with-mesh-and-dropbox.html

and in that article the author says this about mesh....

"s far as I can tell, Live Mesh doesn’t have plans to support a revision system like DropBox. I think this is a horrible, horrible mistake. Having a file on multiple machines provides nice redundancy, yet if you accidentally delete a file on one computer, Live Mesh will happily delete every copy of it. It even happened to Scott Hanselman"

The last sentence is a link to the article I posted talking about the actual "Scott Hanselman" experience.

www.hanselman.com/.../TechnicalPresentationsBePreparedForAbsoluteChaos.aspx

Take a moment, read it through slowly you will get it.

While you are at it, I will take a Big Mac, a desktop PC and since you do servers give me one of those with quad SLI, a killer NIC, 1000 watt PS, with a glass window on the side of the case...and oh dont forget the red neon light, plus some mustard.

"Ocean linked this article....and in that article the author says this about mesh...."

And you tried to back up his wrong argument with an example of what goes wrong when you use a beta application in a production environment, making you look like as much of a fool as him.  Go ahead and backpedal all you want.  We know what you said.  Apologize to us all, but be sure you put some Chapstick on.

"since you do servers give me one of those with quad SLI"

Yup, that sums up your IT knowledge nicely.  I pity any real (not imaginary) clients you may have.

"what goes wrong when you use a beta application in a production environment"

The app wasn't at fault in that situation.

"The app wasn't at fault in that situation."

You can't fault an app.  It was the user's fault in this scenario.

Agreed.

Beta or enterprise ready, the error would have occurred.

I actually tried LiveMesh a few months ago, but it was a horrible pain setting it up and it was an ever bigger pain managing Live Mesh across various computers with different versions of the same document ending up across my computers.

I'll take Dropbox over LiveMesh and iDisk any day of the week. Its flexibility is unrivaled and so are its restore function and sharing capabilities.

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