Is PC World for losers too?

re: Is PC World for losers too?

maati — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 12:10:12 GMT

This ad is sooo bad.

Microsoft could as well have said: "If you can afford a Mac, go get one!"

But that's exactly what everyone knew before... right?

Somehow I feel even Microsoft now thinks that Macs are better and there's no reason for a Windows machine anymore except for the price.

That's sad... but true.

Somehow this ad makes me wanna buy a Mac. And yes, I can afford one...

re: Is PC World for losers too?

gorath — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 11:43:20 GMT

Johnpapola, actually I pretty much agree with your last post on this one, apart from one small point...

I don't see there being much of a "obsessive war against Apple".

I mean, every mac sold, is another potential customer for windows as well.

I think this "war" is something that fanboys/crazies/whatever you call them on BOTH sides of the fence has concocted.

Anyway.

Just to throw another thing into the mix, this remarking that "people" do find the mac cool and aspirational is rubbish IMHO. Sure, some people do, but they're a tiny majority.

Most mac owners that I know just think of it as another kind of computer, they don't see anything 'special' in it that 'sets them apart'.

Of course there are also the mac "enthusiasts" who really do tie their self-worth into their platform of choice, and will take any and all opportunity to tell you about how great apple is, which ironically seems to just annoy people and drives them away from the platform!

We get one in the studio regularly. He's a good bloke, but for the love of your gods, would you shut up about the macbook, and lets get some freaking work done. One or two snide remarks or something is funny, fair enough, but he goes on so much that people get really tired of him really quickly.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

mikegalos@msn.com — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 09:38:51 GMT

Well, this was an amusing thread...

re: Is PC World for losers too?

johnpapola — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 03:47:28 GMT

Hmmm...

Glad to see this site is still a forum for the same nonsense and Apple-obsessed hyperventilating by Paul and the gang. Waethorn, your comments are truly from another dimension. What are you even talking about with that communism remark? Go read a book. ANY book. How are those iPhone sales up there in Canada, btw?

It's pretty clear why none of you work in advertising. My points were quite simple and strictly about the impact of this messaging from a branding point of view. Not about the validity of the criticism. I leave it up to the market and the sales numbers to validate a company's strategy. I prefer the Mac even at current prices. You guys don't. Both positions are a matter of person preference. Whatever.

So far, the market has continued to value Apple's products at their prices, despite the ignorant doomsday wishes of Paul and Enderle and the rest. That is reflected clearly in their sales and, more importantly, their profits. Profit is the measure of success in business. If demand for you product doesn't allow for profitable pricing... there isn't enough demand for the product to exist. Just ask GM, who loses money on every car. You can't make it up in volume or share when each sale is a net loss.

Remember Paul's predictions of Macbook sales collapse after the refresh? Yeah, that played out just the way he expected... or... wait a minute...so far it's been dead wrong.

The fact that Microsoft feels the need to now full on attack the Mac pricing like this in a major media campaign, given it's relative market share, speaks volumes. It validates the success of the platform and drives home that Microsoft believes it's a true competitive threat. The "I'm not cool enough" line doesn't sting Apple or Apple users either. All that does is make the choir of Apple-bashers snicker. Preaching to the choir isn't good advertising. The reality is that a broad audience DOES think the Mac and Apple are cool. So this spot is just plain tone deaf.

The fact is, the value proposition of the PC could stand on it's own. The idea that it's value should be measured against the Mac establishes the Mac as the standard. That's a very weird approach for the company with 90 to 95% of the market.

Then, as others have mentioned, there's the entirely unnecessary, totally weird dishonesty about this actress not being an actress. What does that serve, other than to make Microsoft look desperate. I'm not sure where that idea started, but it's lame as hell.

Hey, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe this will resonate and cause potential switchers to reconsider. I've worked with the creatives at CPB and they're very talented. Their Burger King stuff is pure genius and I was pretty lucky to work with them on an especially weird BK spot last December. But the trajectory of Microsoft's advertising over the past 12 months is basically one of bizarre obsession with Apple that started subtle and now has fully dissolved into a petty price war.

The question, though, remains: why do this? People are fully aware of the price differential. It's front and center at retail. That hasn't mattered for years, as Apple's sales have continued to climb. Even now, I'm sure there's plenty of people for Apple to sell Macs to at their current prices. If Microsoft thinks that this depression is some kind of opening in their obsessive war against Apple, they don't understand the Apple customer base or what resonates in their value proposition to the consumer.

As for share numbers... Cheapo netbooks may be coming in to hurt Apple's marketshare numbers now... but who cares? Those machines are even LESS likely to run additional software than the average PC, making their share pretty meaningless to developers... who are the only audience for which marketshare has any value at all. All that said, I think netbooks ARE pretty cool, if they've got 3G... but then I use my iPhone much the way most use their netbook, so whatever.

And if any of you think that each and every PC maker isn't dying to have Apple's brand power and value proposition to maintain their higher margins, you're nuts. Just look at the Dell Adamo. The reality is that PC prices are lower because they need to be in order to attract the customers.

That's the nature of prices. They emerge from market demand and competition, not cost of goods and certainly not altruism. The notion that PC prices are cheaper because PC makers want to spread the love is just ludicrous. If Apple's demand slumps, those Mac prices will fall. Just look at the iPhone for proof of the Company's willingness to be aggressive on pricing.

None of this is Microsoft bashing. Compared with the government idiocy going on this year and the ruinous bailouts and BS, any company like Microsoft that delivers sustainable business value and productive innovation is great in my book. I admire them, Gates and I reject my former complaints about the monopoly ruling (which I've come to see was just more government BS collusion with politically connected competitors). I want Windows 7 to be AMAZING because competition makes everything better for everyone.

I'm simply saying that this campaign feels desperate. I wouldn't have approached it this way... unless I was told by Microsoft that the Mac was a significant competitive threat and that they demanded we take them on hard.

I didn't even touch on the complex, confusing brand dilution that comes from mixing Windows branding with PC hardware branding.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Lindy — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 02:41:41 GMT

Oh and lets compare battery life between that 17inch low priced HP (6 cell?) with VISTA and a 13inch Macbook OS X. I bet the Macbook gets double the battery life any day of the week.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Lindy — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 02:39:53 GMT

"A Macbook @ 13" just doesn't do CS4 justice." Really? Got any proof?

Seriously the low end Macbook has a 2.0ghz .45nm CPU with 3meg of cache? I am pretty sure that will out perform that AMD Turon deal. With 4gig of RAM in the Macbook I bet you would find that CS4 performs just as well or better than the HP.

"Also, there's eSATA and HDMI on it.

Any Mac's with that?"

Bluetooth, Wireless N, GigE, Firewire....does that PC have that? Its all in what you are looking for.

ESATA and HDMI would be below Wireless N and Bluetooth for me that is for sure. In fact I have never used ESATA or HDMI from any computer I have ever owned, if indeed it even had those options.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Waethorn — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 02:26:45 GMT

I just saw one of those banners. Here was one of the comparisons:

rock + rubber bands + Macbook 13" for $999

Acer Aspire 5735 for $499 + Samsung Omnia + babysitter & a show

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Waethorn — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 02:21:53 GMT

In case anybody missed the link, here it is:

www.bestbuy.com/.../olspage.jsp

Just to set the record straight, that DOES come with Vista Home Premium 64-bit, so all 4GB are available. In fact, the notebook supports up to 8GB of installable RAM. The Macbook only comes with 2 and supports a maximum of 4.

It also includes premium speakers with SRS Surround sound (fake surround, but still better than basic stereo).

Also, there's eSATA and HDMI on it.

Any Mac's with that?

Hmmm???

....

Overall, it's a decent computer for $699 even if it's not anything high-end. It's definitely a better value than that $999 Macbook.

I'd say that it'd certainly work well as a mobile Photoshop CS4 system, what with the native 64-bit support and all. The Radeon isn't anything special but it would still include the GPU acceleration options that would help with CS4. A Macbook @ 13" just doesn't do CS4 justice.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Master3 — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 01:45:19 GMT

"Seriously though that add is not horrible, but it just makes MS look like a sore loser for mentioning and showing Apple. "

As opposed to Apple being a sore loser for mentioning MS and or PCs in almost EVERY ad?

If Apple can do it, then MS has a right to mention them, and a responsibility stick up for itself.

Only to Apple fanboys is this a bad thing.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Waethorn — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 01:12:05 GMT

"Many people got rich from McDonald's, yet they peddle crap food. Nothing to be proud of."

Canadian McDonalds != American McDonalds

Their premium angus beef burgers are as good as anything you can get at a sit-down restaurant. The glam shots are exaggerated, but I've eaten them MANY times, and I can say they come exactly as shown in this pic:

www.mcdepk.ca/.../ABlaunchproductontray.JPG

(well, the burger is INSIDE the box when you get it, and there's no stirling silver tray, or plate, but you get the idea)

$6.99 for a bacon+cheddar angus burger meal combo. I usually get a side salad instead of fries. Ok, and SOMETIMES a couple of pies for $1.29 (they have strawberry pie now too - my favourite!). All in all, it's less than $10CDN after the 13% total sales tax. And I'M FULL! You can't go to any other sit-down restaurant and get as big of a dinner with dessert (x2) included for less than $15 around here anymore.

They use Alberta beef in Canada too. Trans-fat is also gone from almost all menu items. Many new restaurants have a chic new look too. Take a look:

www.mcdepk.ca/Re-ImagingImages.htm

I've been to the one on Ellesmere Rd., in Scarborough, as well as the one on Kennedy:

www.mcdepk.ca/.../65boulevardKennedyLevisQC.jpg

Those locations are nicer than most of the other $15 meal restaurants around here.

BTW: [sic] hammer on the head of anybody that spells it "add". It's "ad", short for "advertisement".

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Lindy — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:30:17 GMT

Master you forgot my name!!!!#$@%&*!!!!!!

www.urbandictionary.com/define.php

I think I remember from the Zuner/Rotten Ronnies lovers blog discussion that Agro Master is a 140lb vegan. Go gettum tiger!!!!!

Seriously though that add is not horrible, but it just makes MS look like a sore loser for mentioning and showing Apple. I like many just blow past all adds these days. As Bettie said at least 50% of any add, from any company is BS.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

chuckb84 — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:09:44 GMT

@master3

Simple message: You forgot your meds today.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

Master3 — Sat, 28 Mar 2009 00:08:09 GMT

@daveinla

You name was added by mistake. Sorry.

re: Is PC World for losers too?

daveinla — Fri, 27 Mar 2009 23:51:20 GMT

Master3, if you read my posts here you would know I'm neither a troll nor an Apple fanatic. I have both a Dell and a macbook at home (caus' I don't want to pay $2000 for a mac laptop).

I use use PCs more often than mac because of my workplace...

re: Is PC World for losers too?

bettieblu — Fri, 27 Mar 2009 23:39:03 GMT

Master I imagine you as a sad little, little man, that really needs to keep on the meds brother.

Seriously read YOUR rant (s), then take your meds.

The add is a lame attempt at trying to get back at Apple for their very sussesful add campain. Not many people really believe what is in any add from Apple or anyone else, they judge these days more on entertainment vaule that actual truth value, if they dont Tivo past them in the first place. Hence all the hype around Super Bowl adds.